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Navigating Career Transitions in a Complex World — with Becky Heidesch
Leadership Powered by Common Sense with Doug Thorpe
Introduction
Well, hello again, everyone. This is Doug Thorpe, and you’re listening to Leadership Powered by Common Sense. Hey, you know, we live in a pretty complex world, and it impacts career thinking in many different ways. So today we’re going to dive in to a discussion about all the many facets that may be impacting and influencing people’s opportunities and their choice for career moves and advancement. My guest is a person who’s worked in that space for some time now. Her name is Becky Heidesch. Becky, welcome to the show.
Thanks for having me, Doug, it’s great to be here.
Meet Becky Heidesch
Yeah, it’s a little bit of a tradition here, and I asked my guest to give a quick flyover of your journey that got you into the work you’re doing now.
Gosh. Well, it certainly wasn’t a planned trajectory. I started out high school, college athletics, spent about ten years health physical education, worked at a couple different colleges.
Then I made my first career transition. So I learned my first lessons on career transition. And, it worked in the private sector, took a corporate administrative role for a summer that turned into human resources. I was in that role for about five years. And then while I was looking for my dream job in sports marketing, so I started a sports publication, which was focused on the women’s side of it, the business side of it, the women’s sports wire.
My first subscriber was the NCAA, and I ran that publication a few years and moved it into a sports marketing agency with an event division, consulting division, and a career division. Consulting opened up doors. I had a chance to work side by side with Marilyn Ashman, chairman of the board for Ashman Sporting Goods. Did a partnership with Franklin Covey, which I know you had worked with in the past, and we launched a couple of online career centers, and then really from there evolved into executive search and job placement. And today I’m doing consulting and writing and speaking.
The Career Landscape Has Changed
Wonderful. Well, you’re right, like many of us that are up in years of the trajectory wasn’t necessarily planned exactly, but one opportunity led to another and so on and so on. We were talking in the green room about the relativity of things that are happening right now. I made the statement that I’ve got the benefit of many years, and actually, you could call them decades of experience watching market shifts and business climate change.
It gives it allows an incredible perspective of hearing someone’s issue and concern, and making a bit of a relativity assessment about how big or small that might be, and offer maybe some calm in the face of a storm. But a lot of people in the workplace now don’t yet have that, so whatever they’re facing for the first time is significantly new and different to them. So it’s the next big mountain they have to climb. You had some great comments about that. And please share those.
Yeah. Well, you know, it’s such a good topic. And, you know, years ago, it just seemed so much simpler, right? As many things did.
Right. And we would declare a major going into college and we would start out in a career path and in some cases, even our parents generations, 25 years in, you know, golden handcuffs, retire from that same job or career field. You know, nowadays, I mean, they used to say, you know, we used to like to think, see people move, maybe, you know, on average maybe 5 to 7 years. I mean, of course, if somebody was in a lane, not any sooner than that. Right? So if somebody was in a lane for ten, 15 years, you got some great experience, continued moving up. Those were all really good things today.
You know that the chairs are moving much, much quicker. Right. So it started with technology. And now the mindset, you know, of young people is that, you know, we don’t have that same, you know, stickiness to the loyalty we used to have years ago.
So you have all of that going on. You have a changing marketplace, as you know, in your background, and business is changing every single day. And industries are coming and going. And so you watch the markets and you watch what’s happening, you know, and we’re in a global world today and of course everything online, it’s all changed.
And so, you know, I think one of the things I learned over the years in making my career transitions, the mistakes I made than working with so many senior level executives and watching them try to make career transitions or change careers, move up the things that they, you know, where their goals were. What I realized was we just aren’t talking about career management the same way we talk about our health management or our financial management or things like that.
And, you know, I really thought people have to kind of think about what is really critically important and what’s an easy foundation for people to kind of think about when they’re young and they’re planning their career, they’re midstream, and they want to make changes, you know, or maybe they want to, you know, everybody’s wanting to live and work longer.
Introducing the STEEP Qualifications Framework
Today we are living and working longer, right? And everybody’s wanting to kind of work. Or maybe they need to work longer. So I came up with a STEEP qualifications framework, which is really Skills, Tools, Education, Experience, and Personal Qualifications.
And I think that’s an easy way for people to just think about where they are today, where it is that they want to go and consider what they need. I talk about in my book The Career Masterclass for Women. I talk about the different buckets that people have and those are the different buckets.
And throughout our careers, we’ve got to be, you know, emptying and refilling those buckets along the way. And in the past, we would just look at a degree of field, go into it and we’re done. Now it is, you know, skills can be outdated within six months.
So staying engaged, staying marketable, staying relevant to the marketplace, you know, it’s a much more active process. And if you don’t get in the driver’s seat of managing that career and your career, then you’ll find that somebody else is managing it for you.
So I think that’s one thing that’s that I think is important in terms of a starting point for people today.
Your Career Path Lives in the Rearview Mirror
I tell the story back in my banking days, our chairman spoke at an all hands meeting, classic sort of annual reset and launch for the new year. And among several things he said he actually, brought up the point that career pathing is a thing of the past. He said literally, that the only career path you’re going to see is in your rearview mirror.
But the way forward is to be designed and conquered in your own way and in your own speed. And, you know, we as a company are going to have many opportunities and some of which we don’t even know what they are yet. So we are going to need talent to navigate those waters. And you may be one that gets picked to help us do that, or you may go another direction, but we just don’t know.
So it was a pivot point. It had been a long standing tradition that people talked about career path. And there was usually some mechanism when you did annual reviews to talk about next step, next grade, next position. And there was a logic to it and it truer words were probably never spoken. And it certainly fit our situation for the next 10 or 15 years. But it really was a foretelling of exactly where we are now.
And and to your point, people have embraced the fluidity of it in, in one way, in that, yeah, you look at somebody’s resume now, a 30 something year old person, they’ve got a year and a half here or two years there, another 12 months somewhere else. And in many cases that’s actually good. There is a story to be told, but, there are those of us that initially look at that and go, what’s wrong with you? You know, why can’t you keep a job? You know, and that’s not fair. And that’s just not necessarily fair to assume that as you look at that record.
Yeah, it’s a good, you know, and, you know, from your work to, in coaching and, you know, with placement, I mean, one of the things that we always did look at and continue to we do like to see longevity.
We do like to see a commitment. You know, we think it’s important. And from learning the skills, learning that organization, being a part of that and the growth and, you know, just the working with people to achieve a goal and staying with the process, you know, so there is something, you know, there’s a lot of things in the past that are still true and tried today, you know, in terms of success and like a work ethic and showing up and dependability and responsibility and things like that and commitment. So they’re all still really good things.
I think, you know, one of the things I we’ve changed from, you know, 1 or 2 kind of careers in somebody’s lifetime to multiple moves in a lifetime. And I think where, you know, when I look at my career and the different fields and industries I’ve worked in and the different pivots I’ve made. You know, and the mistakes I’ve made in making those pivots, but also the opportunities and things that came, I think more or less what I’ve experienced is what many people are going to be experience going forward.
The Three-Career Strategy
And you really have to be in charge of that and navigating that and knowing how to pivot and where to go next and what to do in finding that alignment between your skills and, you know, passions are important, but also market opportunities are important. You know, I was in women’s sports and diversity recruiting long before those things were, you know, even on the radar. And so market opportunity is important.
All of these things are important for young people to think about in terms of a career. But one of the things I try now with, if I’m talking to younger people, is instead of declaring a major and thinking, this is what you’re going to do, it’s so hard for young people to just say, this is it. I really try to get people to think, and even for midstream and everybody else to think of a three career strategy.
You know, something in your 20s and 30s may not be what you want to do in your 40s and 50s, and what you’re doing in your 40s and 50s may not be what you want to do 60 on plus, but you can start.
And if you look at things that way, you don’t have so much pressure in terms of this is the field I went in. And if people get stuck, then they don’t know how to get out of it or transition. But if they start to look at their life like they’re going to build on it, maybe they’re going to do this first and then, you know, maybe they start out in accounting and then maybe they, you know, want to move into maybe they’re working for a large firm, then they want to run their own business, and then they’re doing something else over here.
But if you can learn to kind of stack those opportunities and look at it that way. I think that is really the future of where it’s going. And, you know, I think we’ve got something like it’s close to 87 million. I think freelancers right now in the country, and that is continuing to grow. And as the opportunities online and people wanting to work remote here and there. That’s going to grow.
But we also still have the need for corporate and the trades. And so I think each one of those paths is going to provide different opportunities. And the people that really can stay relevant, stay engaged, manage the skills, the tools, the education, the experience, and really have what it takes that resiliency to bounce back and to go after the next thing and you know, is what it’s really going to take to be successful.
Go Corporate First, Then Consider Buying a Business
Well, I’ll insert an option in that stack. And I agree with you in general, what the perhaps healthier, more optimistic outlook might be is to plan on that three career journey. As part of that, and I’ve done some work in this space, is the notion of go ahead and take that corporate job, get your benefits and your opportunities there. Build a little war chest of financing and do that for ten, 15, 20 years. And then you can always consider going out to the market and finding a pre-existing, already cash flowing business to buy.
And there are some great opportunities to do that. And then, you know, what I’m saying is that notion of wanting to be an entrepreneur and try to hit that right out of the gate, that inevitably involves a startup process, and startups don’t have a great mortality rate. You know, they and it’s not for lack of trying on the founders part, but the reality is that the numbers are fundamentally against you.
So I’m not trying to be a naysayer for those who have the entrepreneurial bent, but for those maybe more mortal folk that might be out there, you know, go ahead and take that corporate job, build that war chest. And then at a later date, when you’ve got a little more of your own experience and maturity, and you’re better equipped to take on that independence of owning and operating a business, you can go make that acquisition and potentially even start a portfolio of those kind of companies.
And, you know, you can quickly replace your annual compensation if you do it right and you can have a pretty good lifestyle living that entrepreneurial life.
Absolutely. I could not agree more. I wish I had gone all of that route, you know, in that way. So absolutely. I mean, I think, you know, the there’s so many benefits, you know, besides the fact that you’ve got the training that’s provided when you’re working for a larger company, you know, just maximizing that training, the mentoring, the coaching, you know, learning how to work, learning how to show up, learning how, how and when to speak in a meeting.
All of the things that you that those environments can provide. You are really, really important. And absolutely I think, you know, get that, get the get the consistent paycheck, you know, get the stock options, get the retirement package, get those things going and get that foundation before you go on. And I absolutely believe that.
And I will say too, there are people when I, you know, we referenced like a three career strategy or multi career strategy, there are people that, you know, jump into one thing and they love it and they are just on that and they stay on that path and that’s great.
You know that. That’s great. You know I’ve also learned that, you know, we change our interest, my passion and interest. And what I wanted to do at 20 wasn’t what I wanted to do at 30 or 40. You know, our interest change, dynamics change, business comes and goes, industries change.
And then of course, life changes. And we have all of these other things that come into whether it’s caretaking or this or that, all of those things come into play in terms of what we might want to be doing and how we want to structure our work at that time. So I think having a view like that is going to help people. So it’s not just so focused and narrowed, but they realize that they will have choices and opportunities. But again, those choices and opportunities do come with consequences too.
Sure.
Absolutely. There are risks and rewards associated with everything, and it is a matter of doing a good assessment and determining what the best fit might be.
Social Media’s Hidden Threat to Your Career
We’d like to talk a little more about what we began in the green room, the idea of so many other influences now out there. But and we might sound like we’re going to beat up on social media, but again, it’s an undeniable force that is influencing the way people think and act and create their own expectations. So talk again about some of the other factors you’ve observed that are impacting people, and how they may or may not be dealing with it.
Well, I think, it’s a very important topic because I think people’s careers and livelihoods — it’s when somebody loses that or, you know, there’s something that happens and they’ve lost their job or they’ve lost that opportunity and that it’s their whole livelihood. And so I think it’s impactful and it’s it can be traumatizing for people. It can be a huge loss like any other loss in their life.
But I think today we face so many more risks. I mean, you know, it was probably somewhere between 10 to 15 years ago where we in terms of vetting candidates, right. We would start to look at the social media. We’d start to look at that, and then we would have these periodic things come up with clients where something surfaced with a candidate online, so they no longer were interested in this one. Or, you know, maybe we came across something that was bothersome and we knew it would be bothersome, you know, to the client. That’s where it kind of started.
But in the last five years we have really seen an acceleration with that. And it doesn’t take anybody to watch what’s going on. Right. You know, whatever channel you turn it on and something has come up of somebody passed and you know, people are just being, you know, I mean, fair or not fair or right or wrong. You know, that’s not really, you know, the position that I’m taking here, but it’s a more or less that people have to be careful, more careful than ever. And we have young people today that everything is posted online. Their entire lives are posted online.
And, you know, I’ve had the smallest situations happen with candidates where something was posted 20 years ago at a, you know, wedding thing or this or that, and they lose out in a career opportunity. So watching and seeing what’s going on today, you know, where you have defamation, you’ve got lawsuits, you’ve got cancel culture, you’ve got all of these things going on. And the attacks that people are facing, you know, it’s just gotten to a point where that has become a huge risk anymore.
You know, it’s really affecting people. And so where does that stop, you know, where does that to where the place is, where, you know, all of these things. Another area on discrimination. You know, we used to see a lot of, you know, mostly gender and race and things like that, now, you know, you’ve got political religion, you’ve got all these areas.
And so it’s just created an environment that’s not very safe today for people in terms of the vulnerability of their careers. And then you’ve got to throw in the, you know, economic and geopolitical risk and all of these other things. AI. It’s just an extremely, you know, people are very, very vulnerable today, I think, to things that could happen to them, the unexpected.
Yeah. It is somewhat daunting to think about all the elements and all the aspects of it. And I do agree, you know, a lot of employers have relied on content that’s been put out to make hire or no hire decisions for people that definitely affect someone’s opportunity. And, you know, right or wrong, it’s a reality of what we’re dealing with with a lot of this stuff.
I know I have, you know, five adult children and I can fundamentally say four out of the five shuns social media. They don’t even have Facebook accounts and Twitter accounts and Instagram accounts and they just they don’t see any benefit in it at all.
And if anything, they see more liability. And they’ve made the call that it disrupts their psychology to even follow some of that stuff because, yeah, it can get you thinking in the wrong direction depending on what you might be predisposed to do. And and I’ve actually had guests on the show here who have argued it is contributing to the national mental health crisis.
Absolutely, absolutely. I would wholeheartedly agree.
Revisiting the STEEP Model in Depth
Yeah. So let’s circle back to your model. Tell us again the buckets that are in your model. Skills…
So it’s STEEP. STEEP. Skills. Tools. Education. Experience and Personal Qualifications. And at different times, you know your skills are more relevant, education’s more relevant, experience’s more relevant, tools. But those are the key components that, you know, I really believe are at the cornerstone of anybody planning, building, changing, wanting to advance in their career needs to start with that platform and look at those buckets today.
What’s in those buckets today where they are today, if they want to make a change or they want to move up or change careers or change industries, then you have to look at each one of those buckets and you have to look at, you know, what it is that you have, where it is you want to go and what’s missing in the middle.
And so that’s really the bridge that has to be built. And when most people take a look at what they have in the STEEP qualifications, and then they really consider — I have a course coming out that’s about making a successful career transition. And it’s on this the same path. And so it’s really taking a look at what they have, where it is they want to go. And so it’s really taking a look at what they have, where it is they want to go.
And we go through this and they take three target roles that they’re kind of interested in. And then you go through the process and you determine, you know, do you want to build this bridge or this bridge or this bridge. And when people kind of go through that process, they begin to kind of think, is that really what I want to do?
And a lot of times people start off on a path and they’re just unsure. So they quit. They stop. They know that their discontent and their current situation, but they don’t know what they want. So that’s one of the things. And then second of all is they go through kind of these exercises and we look at these things and then of course culture fit and what kind of lifestyle you want.
And these other things play a little role. But for the most part when they look at that realistically, then they’re able to kind of say, okay, if I’m going to do this, I’m going to go back and get this certification. Or if I’m going to do this, I’m going to go back and do this or no, I don’t want to do this, but I think I want to do this.
And so once they think about that and then they put a plan together, they’re going to have a much better chance of being successful and making that career transition than just trying to guess it. And that’s, you know, people applying for multiple jobs online today, not hearing back or applying for jobs that technically they’re not qualified for. You know, they may they may think they’re qualified for it, and they may in fact be able to do the job, but that doesn’t really mean that they’re going to get through the paper screening process to get that opportunity to interview. So it’s taking a look at all of those kinds of things and using that as a model that they can use again and again throughout their career.
Practical Takeaways: Build an Accomplishments Inventory
Yeah. You know, one element that I’ve had a lot of experience dealing with is that hunger to be fulfilled in the work you do because, you know, let’s face it, we spend a good chunk of our waking hours doing work. And if you’re not going to have some sense of fulfillment in general, you won’t have it 100% of the time anywhere but you want to have it most of the time.
And, a lot of times people that have been in work at work for a while start to feel the tug of that need to, you know, satisfy that urge. And one method that I’ve found effective, I’ve encouraged people to build what we call an accomplishments inventory. Just a single bulleted list of things you’ve been a part of or been involved with and go back, I think, in hiring and placement, they call it the STAR model. And and you know, that’s similar and can be used as well. But build this list of these line items and then go back and grade them with a simple plus or minus.
The plus being yes, it really motivated you. You really felt fulfilled. You were excited, engaged fully. You know your cup was full for doing that. But then the minuses are the ones you say, yeah, you know, yes, I got it done. Yes, it was a thing. But I’ll be happy if I don’t ever have to do that again.
So when you get that plus and minus grading applied, then you can go back and group all of the pluses and see if there’s not a pattern that emerges. And I can give you some quick examples. Sometimes the pattern is about dealing with the people that were involved in those things. Sometimes it was the technology, sometimes it was the science or the analytics or the subject matter focus.
Other times it can be things like that was a startup initiative. You know, I was asked to create a new team or create a new product or launch a product. Other times it could be. I was called in to be the Fix-It person. You know, it was broken and I came in and I got it turned around. There’s a pattern to those pluses. That will be a strong indicator of what you’re best suited to do going forward. So if you’re in a moment of transition, why not hone down your prospect list and look for the opportunities that are 100% that specialty?
Yes. Excellent advice. I love it. Yeah, that’s, you know, it. It is. It’s looking at patterns and things. I mean, that’s the hindsight of of wisdom, right? 2020. And that’s looking back and being able to kind of identify those things. But yeah, all of the soul searching that kind of goes into reflecting on the experiences somebody had, successes, failures, all of those types of things and, are all really important things to think about.
And, you know, consider in either a next move and, you know, passion — I can remember, you know, years ago everybody would just say, follow your passion, follow your passion.
Right. And I did, you know, I did a lot of things that I really wanted to do, that I had an interest in following that passion. But then I also learned that, hey, you know, sometimes that doesn’t pay the bills, right? And, and, you know, you kind of learn the more practicalities that are all there.
So I think it is important to think about the whole picture. Right. And as much as you can kind of reflect on that whole picture, and certainly where you’ve had success and where you’ve had those accomplishments like you alluded to in those patterns are really important, you know, and also finding finding the things you really do have an interest and passion in is also important.
And if you can find that intersection between your skills, passion, opportunities, successes, and where there’s opportunity for the future, I think always keeping kind of that lens on it will will help guide in terms of, you know, some of these next moves.
Closing Thoughts
Right. Right.
Well, Becky, I think we’re about up on time for today. This has been great. Tell people the best way to get in touch with you.
Becky Heidesch dot com, they can find me there. They can find me on LinkedIn. They Google my name. They’ll they’ll be able to find me.
We do have some specific links for that information that’ll be included in the show notes, so please feel free to drop down and manage those buttons and give Becky a shout out. But one last time. Becky. Thank you so much for doing this. It’s been great.
Yeah. Thank you. Thanks for having me. It’s been great to chat. Take care.
Wonderful. I do like to remind everybody we have a video version of this show over on YouTube channel by the same name. Leadership Powered by Common Sense. Check out our archives there and please leave us some comments. Subscribe, if you will, to the channel. That’s how we keep paying the bills here. But for now we’re going to sign off, say goodbye, go out there and make it a great day.
Meet Our Guest
Becky Heidesch is the founder of two online career centers, and a nationwide boutique executive search firm, where she has interviewed hundreds of executives and placed senior level women in dozens of industries in corporate America. Over several decades, she has held various job titles, including coach, assistant professor, director of human resources, entrepreneur, publisher, sports marketer, and executive recruiter. She has served as a consultant for Oshman’s Sporting Goods, Franklin Covey, and Hyundai Motor America.
Becky is an industry and media resource and recognized nationally in college textbooks and print media, including the Orange County Register, Los Angeles Times, Sports Business Journal, Athletic Business, Sports Traveler. She has also been featured on NBC, OCN, and the S&P Global podcast. As a public speaker, she has led career seminars for companies and organizations, along with various women’s groups including, Women in Automotive, Women in Financial, Women in Government, and Women in Sports.She holds bachelor’s and master’s degrees from California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo, and a Master of Business Administration (MBA) from Concordia University.
As a California native, she cherishes her non-working moments with her family, friends, and Gen Z teenager. In her free time, she enjoys exercising, being on or near the water, golfing, or practicing yoga.She holds bachelor’s and master’s degrees from California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo, and a Master of Business Administration (MBA) from Concordia University. As a California native, she cherishes her non-working moments with her family and her Gen Z teenager. When not working she enjoys exercising, being on or near the water, practicing yoga or golfing.
Links:
www.BeckyHeidesch.com
www.WSSExecutiveSearch.com
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